QuattroGam3r 508 Posted June 17, 2015 I swear to god, read the friggin TuT on MPLS... Not you Felida, you know what I'm talking about. Dragon, there are even pictures that illustrate what I'm talking about with path selection that occurs on MPLS and OSPF networks. BGP also if you live in Australia/Asia Here Dragon READ https://www.nanog.org/meetings/nanog49/presentations/Sunday/mpls-nanog49.pdf Don't listen to static, his Cisco certs mean nothing, he's making it all up. lmao 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
felida 1653 Posted June 17, 2015 I swear to god, read the friggin TuT on MPLS... Not you Felida, you know what I'm talking about. Dragon, there are even pictures that illustrate what I'm talking about with path selection that occurs on MPLS and OSPF networks. BGP also if you live in Australia/Asia Here Dragon READ https://www.nanog.org/meetings/nanog49/presentations/Sunday/mpls-nanog49.pdf yeah i know.. lol.. different parts of the world have certain limits, and also throttle their users and such.. but the huge bottleneck it's self, is the fact that the XB is receiving info from 300+ people in lobbies and such.. and the XB can only process SOOO much.. hence his misconception of it being faster when there is 30 people.. as the xb only has to process 30 ppl, instead of 100's as this is nothing unity is processing.. lol it's like me having a dialup, and bitching saying google is slow.. more power means faster results.. and the XB is limited to the info it can process.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 No, there's a login server, and a lobby server most likely more than one. Logging in should be the only place you would get lag if 800 people connected simultaneously. All other lag will occur only in the game lobby (If looking for a room), the game room (if looking for a game), or the people in the game itself while they are playing the game. this is what i am talking about. i said several times that i am not talking about in game lag. if there will be 800 people on system link and they will search for different rooms and kick people (for everyone that u kick u have to refresh again), will it take me 10minutes so sign in a room or if the system itself can overload. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
QuattroGam3r 508 Posted June 17, 2015 On that note, i'm going to bed. Night y'all 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
felida 1653 Posted June 17, 2015 just died laughing.. hahahahaha Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StaticPulse 262 Posted June 17, 2015 yeah i know.. lol.. different parts of the world have certain limits, and also throttle their users and such.. but the huge bottleneck it's self, is the fact that the XB is receiving info from 300+ people in lobbies and such.. and the XB can only process SOOO much.. hence his misconception of it being faster when there is 30 people.. as the xb only has to process 30 ppl, instead of 100's as this is nothing unity is processing.. lol Whats more so, when you connect to a different part of the world you re-encapsulate your data so that its compatible with the routing protocol being used. And Dragon, your buddy on Fiber Optic gets awesome speed, his connection is slow because your connection is slow. Back to my first point. In a Peer-To-Peer game, the fastest connection is the slowest link.... Otherwise everyone would fall out of synch with eachother and then the game would have lag hopping and the such which does occur at times regardless.KILL IT WITH FIRE!!!!! this is what i am talking about. i said several times that i am not talking about in game lag. if there will be 800 people on system link and they will search for different rooms and kick people (for everyone that u kick u have to refresh again), will it take me 10minutes so sign in a room or if the system itself can overload. And your lobby connect speed isn't the 800 people on System LiNK either, its the amount of people simultaneously connecting to the specific game at the time you are. Just because CoD Black Ops 2 connects slowly doesn't mean my connect to Diablo 3 is just as slow. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
felida 1653 Posted June 17, 2015 Whats more so, when you connect to a different part of the world you re-encapsulate your data so that its compatible with the routing protocol being used. And Dragon, your buddy on Fiber Optic gets awesome speed, his connection is slow because your connection is slow. Back to my first point. In a Peer-To-Peer game, the fastest connection is the slowest link.... Otherwise everyone would fall out of synch with eachother and then the game would have lag hopping and the such which does occur at times regardless. i'd like this post, if i hadn't reached my maximum.. lol.. And your lobby connect speed isn't the 800 people on System LiNK either, its the amount of people simultaneously connecting to the specific game at the time you are. Just because CoD Black Ops 2 connects slowly doesn't mean my connect to Diablo 3 is just as slow. This one too!! lol 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanyDiJ 0 Posted June 17, 2015 Lucky, i'm with u,(xTHORxDaNi) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StaticPulse 262 Posted June 17, 2015 you seriously are missing some key points.. ISP's throttle their users, at different times of the day.. Not only do they throttle, but if you're on a line like cable, You're sharing one node with multiple subscribers, and their traffic effects your connection speed as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 And your lobby connect speed isn't the 800 people on System LiNK either, its the amount of people simultaneously connecting to the specific game at the time you are. Just because CoD Black Ops 2 connects slowly doesn't mean my connect to Diablo 3 is just as slow. thank you this is what i am talking about. i am NOT talking about the ingame speed. like you said the lobby connect speed depends on the amounth of people that are simultaneously loading rooms and refreshing, because they want to get in a specific room that is ful or they are kicking people (u have to refresh for every single person u kick). so lets say 800 people play bo2. will the room load 5min or more when there will be so many people connected? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StaticPulse 262 Posted June 17, 2015 thank you this is what i am talking about. i am NOT talking about the ingame speed. like you said the lobby connect speed depends on the amounth of people that are simultaneously loading rooms and refreshing, because they want to get in a specific room that is ful or they are kicking people (u have to refresh for every single person u kick). so lets say 800 people play bo2. will the room load 5min or more when there will be so many people connected? This cannot be fixed with System LiNK, a centralized server would be needed for high traffic games. Which would bring up the age old request of creating a private server for XBL games which will never happen as it is not condoned. System Link was not created to host large LAN parties as that is what System Link is for: Small 2-30 player LAN parties. LOCAL play. The plugins allows for WAN connections hence the latency. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 This cannot be fixed with System LiNK, a centralized server would be needed for high traffic games. Which would bring up the age old request of creating a private server for XBL games which will never happen as it is not condoned. System Link was not created to host large LAN parties as that is what System Link is for: Small 2-30 player LAN parties. LOCAL play. The plugins allows for WAN connections hence the latency. ok thank you for your answer. this is all i wanted to know the whole time. my idea was that if we get the money to get a better server, the room login would be faster. it is ok now but when more people come it will get really slow. (i know that this would not help for ingame lag it is just so that the rooms would load fast and that you can kick people and change room fast) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 No, there's a login server, and a lobby server most likely more than one. Logging in should be the only place you would get lag if 800 people connected simultaneously. All other lag will occur only in the game lobby (If looking for a room), the game room (if looking for a game), or the people in the game itself while they are playing the game. this was my point all along. if now system link takes 30 seconds to load a room what will happen when 800 people play? will it take 5 minutes to load rooms? lets say i wanna switch room and it loads 5min and i see its full, than i ress refresh and after 5min of loading the room has 31 players. i press join and after 5min i noticed that t didnt connect me to the room because someone joind the room few seconds before me. than i press refresh again and wait again? If 800 people connect not much will happen at all as the games are hosted from the 30 people playing that specific game at that specific time. Now to connect to the lobby which would host the rooms which host the players, this might cause initial connection lag; however, that wouldn't effect the in-game bandwidth itself. That MPLS tutorial link I just gave you explains a lot at least how the connection made in-game is done over the ISP network. It will always try to forward the packets through the shortest distance path, but sometimes going the long way around is more efficient depending on how many people are sending data. Again, this has nothing to do with your console, your router, or System LiNK. Point being, Even if everything was done as good as it could be done, you will still get lag regardless of the server. and again in this post you confirm what i was talking about all the time and than you start to tal about in game lag again... u can read all the pages and u will see i said it several times that i am not refering to in game lag but i am talking about system link loading rooms. yeah i know.. lol.. different parts of the world have certain limits, and also throttle their users and such.. but the huge bottleneck it's self, is the fact that the XB is receiving info from 300+ people in lobbies and such.. and the XB can only process SOOO much.. hence his misconception of it being faster when there is 30 people.. as the xb only has to process 30 ppl, instead of 100's as this is nothing unity is processing.. lol it's like me having a dialup, and bitching saying google is slow.. more power means faster results.. and the XB is limited to the info it can process.. this is the only valid point. this makes sense. but how can you be sure its not the servers fault? everytime you refresh system link you pull data from the unity server. and there is a difference if 30 people pull data from it or if 300 or 800 people do it. but yes your point is valid. thank you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StaticPulse 262 Posted June 17, 2015 this was my point all along. if now system link takes 30 seconds to load a room what will happen when 800 people play? will it take 5 minutes to load rooms? lets say i wanna switch room and it loads 5min and i see its full, than i ress refresh and after 5min of loading the room has 31 players. i press join and after 5min i noticed that t didnt connect me to the room because someone joind the room few seconds before me. than i press refresh again and wait again? and again in this post you confirm what i was talking about all the time and than you start to tal about in game lag again... u can read all the pages and u will see i said it several times that i am not refering to in game lag but i am talking about system link loading rooms. this is the only valid point. this makes sense. but how can you be sure its not the servers fault? everytime you refresh system link you pull data from the unity server. and there is a difference if 30 people pull data from it or if 300 or 800 people do it. but yes your point is valid. thank you. Honestly, it's most likely your port forwarding config that is lagging you. I don't have that issue connecting to CoD BO2 but whatever. As I said earlier, System LiNK was not made to serve that many users at a given time and what you want would most likely require the framework to be re-written. I'm not a coder and if I was I'd most likely give you an answer that you don't want to hear anyways. That being said, Check your port forwarding config http://www.realmodscene.com/index.php?/topic/3848-tuthow-to-setup-aurora-with-system-link/ On that note I'm off to make me a pot of coffee as its going to be a long day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 Honestly, it's most likely your port forwarding config that is lagging you. I don't have that issue connecting to CoD BO2 but whatever. As I said earlier, System LiNK was not made to serve that many users at a given time and what you want would most likely require the framework to be re-written. I'm not a coder and if I was I'd most likely give you an answer that you don't want to hear anyways. That being said, Check your port forwarding config http://www.realmodscene.com/index.php?/topic/3848-tuthow-to-setup-aurora-with-system-link/ On that note I'm off to make me a pot of coffee as its going to be a long day. so it took 5 pages (4 of them bashing me) to get the answer to the question... thank you Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StaticPulse 262 Posted June 17, 2015 so it took 5 pages (4 of them bashing me) to get the answer to the question... thank you I did tell you twice earlier to check your port forwarding configuration..... At the least you learned something valuable about the equipment that you use and should you decide to explorer networking at least you have a crash course on MPLS traffic routing and a basic understanding about how routing protocols select a route to send data packets to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 I did tell you twice earlier to check your port forwarding configuration..... At the least you learned something valuable about the equipment that you use and should you decide to explorer networking at least you have a crash course on MPLS traffic routing and a basic understanding about how routing protocols select a route to send data packets to. and i did tell u and others that i am not talking about the ingame lag and it still took 4 pages and a picture of a dead horse and me quoting you.... like i said when others say system link is slow it is also slow for me. it doesnt happen that it is slow for me and fast for others. and thank you for the port forwarding link u sent me. my settings are ok. flashed my router with tomato by shibby and all those setiings are applyed. i am also wired and i am limiting other devices connection. and again this was only a suggestion thread. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StaticPulse 262 Posted June 17, 2015 and i did tell u and others that i am not talking about the ingame lag and it still took 4 pages and a picture of a dead horse and me quoting you.... like i said when others say system link is slow it is also slow for me. it doesnt happen that it is slow for me and fast for others. and thank you for the port forwarding link u sent me. my settings are ok. flashed my router with tomato by shibby and all those setiings are applyed. i am also wired and i am limiting other devices connection. and again this was only a suggestion thread. When all else fails do it yourself I guess... Your suggestion won't solve the problem but it does bring up the possibility of problems in the future if we ever get that many people connecting at the same time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 When all else fails do it yourself I guess... Your suggestion won't solve the problem but it does bring up the possibility of problems in the future if we ever get that many people connecting at the same time. thank you. thant was my point all along. its better to think about this thing sonner than later. (cant wait for felida to come back ) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Swizzy 2084 Posted June 17, 2015 Seriously guys? 5 pages in a day? basically repeating the same things over and over in different ways, and throwing rocks at eachother?! Get a grip! Also, please use the edit/multiquote button(s)... it's not hard... really... And yes, there might be an issue with more ppl on LiNK making the server slower, it's all managed in a SQL Database, now the queries might be possible to optimize, or even make it so that the console handles more of the filtering... hell, even making different tables for different titles might make things faster... there are ways of making it all run faster, but it all boils down to what the devs are willing to spend time on right now, a few seconds here and there, or a few milliseconds which it most likely is in most cases isn't going to make it worth spending ALOT of time for... With NOVA things will likely work better, we're not about to go patching up LiNK v1 just before LiNK v2 comes out, we've fixed a bunch of things, which we deemed important, which wasn't super time consuming... I like the idea of having something you can pay for that'll give you something extra, something that gives you the urge to donate... but, i'd probably say it's better to have it just be "Donate and we give you ....", this gives more ppl the urge to donate to the cause... The server isn't particularly old, but it does do multiple tasks, maybe if things grow too much there'll be expansions coming, but that also requires ALOT more donations, right now for instance, there's not enough donations to actually cover all the costs some times, even with the ads that are on the various sites (RMS, Unity and so on) it doesn't always cover the costs of current servers... we're not going to increase the costs unless it's absolutely necessary... 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
felida 1653 Posted June 17, 2015 i did not donate yet. but i would pay 5$ to play system link.my favorite thing about this post, you saying people should pay for Link because it would help make a better server.. yet you haven't donated to help out now.. hypocritical.. j.s.. and im ready to play Seriously guys? 5 pages in a day? basically repeating the same things over and over in different ways, and throwing rocks at eachother?! Get a grip!sorry about that.. but he basically was saying that we all were lying, and didn't know what we were talking about, from the first response i gave him, to the more technical answers from static pulse.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xDRAGONxLuky 54 Posted June 17, 2015 my favorite thing about this post, you saying people should pay for Link because it would help make a better server.. yet you haven't donated to help out now.. hypocritical.. j.s.. and im ready to play sorry about that.. but he basically was saying that we all were lying, and didn't know what we were talking about, from the first response i gave him, to the more technical answers from static pulse.. i did not donate since i had a fealing that it will not solve anything. but i would be the first to pay if nova would be payable (obviously since i created this thread). my idea was that we stup up as a comunity and buy a new server or pay for better internet connection. whatever the devs need to make it work better. and common felida i never said u guys were lieing... you didnt even bother to read what i wrote and attacked me. be a man like _-=SτÅTìC Pu£53=-_ who atleast stopped this nonsense... but you would never admit you were wrong, even tho swizzy himself agrees with what i said. the whole time you were talking about how its all xbox fault and than you were talking about how ingame lag works, even tho i told you several times i am not talking about in game lag. well done felida. be a man and grow a pair and admit you were wrong and end of the story. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gavin_darkglider 1562 Posted June 17, 2015 Just gonna add my 2 cents here...... Knowing what I know about computers, and networking, the speed increases you are looking for probably wont come the way you expect it. As stated many times in this thread, and in any real post about Computing in any enviornment, it is slowed down to the weakest link. It doesnt matter if you are copying files from a dvd to a hdd, which would slow the copy transfer to the speed of the disc drive, or from a sata hdd to an IDE hdd. Now I know this isnt about data copying, but the same rules apply to a network, both a private lan, or a VPN, which link is. Also as stated before, Link V1 uses HTTP protocols for connecting, which slows your connection to the Link VPN to the speed of the HTTP protocol. Once connected to the VPN, it is a matter of the slowest network connected to the game. Which is why if one player starts to lag, all players, other then the host start to lag. To deter this they have put limits on how many people can join a room, and games have limits on how many people can join the game. Then we also have to take into account the hardware we are running the game on. I am not against having new players/accounts pay a little bit per year, but I do think that people that have been supporting link since day 1, Like I have been, and many others, especially those that have gone above and beyond for the advancement of the scene should not have to pay at all. then there is the whole thought process of other services, such as Xlink Kai, which have been around longer, and could easily be used to replace link, if people didnt want to pay for the service. I know people that modded their xbox just so they didnt have to pay the price for live, and while I understand why microshaft has a paid online service, I have never completely agreed with it. That was the one thing I liked about the PSN, well before they constituted the same payed for service, was when it started out it was free. All that being said, there are more ways to donate to the scene, other than money. I can hardly pay my bills, but my donations are all in helping others out with their xbox problems, modderating these forums, writing/testing new apps, etc. I am sure if you talk to the right people you will find that there are other ways to donate, that are just as helpful, if not more helpful, than money. i did not donate since i had a fealing that it will not solve anything. but i would be the first to pay if nova would be payable (obviously since i created this thread). my idea was that we stup up as a comunity and buy a new server or pay for better internet connection. whatever the devs need to make it work better. and common felida i never said u guys were lieing... you didnt even bother to read what i wrote and attacked me. be a man like _-=SτÅTìC Pu£53=-_ who atleast stopped this nonsense... but you would never admit you were wrong, even tho swizzy himself agrees with what i said. the whole time you were talking about how its all xbox fault and than you were talking about how ingame lag works, even tho i told you several times i am not talking about in game lag. well done felida. be a man and grow a pair and admit you were wrong and end of the story. Dont attack other users, for having their own opinion, based upon the technical aspect of all of this. Especially since I know personally that felida has done a lot more for the scene than you have. I have no problem with charging people to use certain features of link, as long as the current userbase continues to get the same service for free for their many years of service and use. New users are a different story though. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
felida 1653 Posted June 17, 2015 i did not donate since i had a fealing that it will not solve anything. but i would be the first to pay if nova would be payable (obviously since i created this thread). my idea was that we stup up as a comunity and buy a new server or pay for better internet connection. whatever the devs need to make it work better. and common felida i never said u guys were lieing... you didnt even bother to read what i wrote and attacked me. be a man like _-=SτÅTìC Pu£53=-_ who atleast stopped this nonsense... but you would never admit you were wrong, even tho swizzy himself agrees with what i said. the whole time you were talking about how its all xbox fault and than you were talking about how ingame lag works, even tho i told you several times i am not talking about in game lag. well done felida. be a man and grow a pair and admit you were wrong and end of the story. umm apearantly you don't understand how bandwidth works.. how little the "hud" has access to the ram/CPU to produce the loading of the rooms.. versus the entire 512mb that the XB has.. you apparently blame unity for your shit connection that i watched you have while playing a game hosted by your "clan croonie".. you red-bared left/right.. but try and blame something that ISNT the problem?? but still, you bitch about unity being slow, and want Nova to be paid for.. but yet haven't donated 1 cent to the cause now? hypocritical.. how is something supposed to be produced without funding? lmao.. but all in all.. you are entitled to your own opinion.. just 2 other people gave you various reasons as to why your loading sucks ass.. but yet everyone else is wrong.. as you are implying that i should admit i was wrong? lmao.. i wasn't.. there are several reasons why YOU take forever to load unity, VS others.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StaticPulse 262 Posted June 17, 2015 Now I know this isnt about data copying, but the same rules apply to a network, both a private lan, or a VPN, which link is. Also as stated before, Link V1 uses HTTP protocols for connecting, which slows your connection to the Link VPN to the speed of the HTTP protocol. Once connected to the VPN, it is a matter of the slowest network connected to the game. Data is data and you're absolutely right it follows very similar principles of the local bus in a PC. Didn't know Link was based off the transport layer. Its a shame we can't circumvent it to run from the data link layer and incorporate ipv6 to just connect players via their mac address. That would probably greatly improve the connection speed I think. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
